Recliner's Rolex Journey

[jason_recliner]

As a dive watch fan who grew up reading National Geographic, I always wanted a Sub, Sea-Dweller, or GMT when I was a kid. When I started to REALLY get into watches, I learnt that they are more of a status symbol than a typical watch. The prices were crazy, but I still wanted one. On my honeymoon I was lucky enough to land THE sports Rolex, a 16600.

That was 4 1/2 years ago and I have enjoyed it, it's been a great watch, it's Rolex at the top of their game. Which, unfortunately, was MANY years ago. In a way it is the ultimate dive watch, having been developed during an era when watches were instruments, not luxury jewellery, and was worn on the deepest ever dive.

But now I'm bored of it. It's just a steel watch, I've owned much better watches for a fraction of the price, I'm thankfully now immune to the Rolex marketing juggernaut. It was fun, but I'm really looking forward to having the cash!

All of Rolex's innovations in the last two decades have been in marketing or business management. They benefit Rolex greatly but the consumer nil, apart from telling people who notice that you can afford to strap a used car to your wrist. That's not me - I'm just an ordinary guy who likes watches!

So long, Rolex!

[nikfs1881]

That's true but with luxury items, it will always be about market positioning: 'branding', prices and the marketing tag line.....no matter what brand, either omega, breitling, patek or rolex..... The real cost of a luxury watch is only a fraction of what you paid.....so, there's nothing wrong with buying any brand as long as you are satisfied with the amount of cash that you have to part with...... Be it rollie or omega or even casio..... You could argue rolex lack of innovation but to most people and collectors, that's rolex main strength.....


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[jason_recliner]

I agree to an extent. BUT...

I still feel that many aspects of the watch are quantifiable. I can see that high end Seiko had better brushing and polishing and machining than Rolex, much more manual labor, for much less $$$. Omega is pretty much the same thing as Rolex - mass produced high quality Swiss watch - for 1/2 to 2/3 the price. So I can actually see some value there, even in the context of overpriced luxury goods.

Each to their own, just sharing my experience. And glad no more of my money will be going to them!

Ps - Rolex fans git me up for a good deal on a 16600!

[r3kahsttub]

Aiyoh! I bo lui now!

[Friedrice]

I always believe in buying a brand before it become famous.

I bought my first Rolex in the early 2000's when submariners were sold for RM12k retail. At that time they were expensive but still affordable.

Bought 3 Rolexes over the years and sold two for a nice profit (both were sports models). Kept the unwanted DJ

Flipped a Patek Philippe 5035YG before the prices became stupid. During the early part of 2000, PP's can be had for up to 40% discount in a shop in the old starhill among other places. Prices then were more reasonable as a 5035 retailed for RM40+k (before discounts). I bought it and resold it a few years later for a decent profit. The servicing cost scared me silly so I had to flip it before it is in need of servicing.

Also bought and flipped a Pam but I took a slight hit. So, I am guessing, watch prices, which have been increasing steadily over the last decade have now plateau.

I am buying up Omega's for a good part of the last 8 years but I am not seeing much ROI as I am used to. So, now, I am just basically buying what I like and no longer going after the next hot brand.

My two cents.

[hanz079]

I tot u got ur Patek 5035Y from your friend that chucks the watches in the glove compartment of his
BMW?

[Narco]

Thats one honest story. I like. It makes 'poor' people like me feel proud not owning one despite the fact that i cant afford one.

[Friedrice]

I tot u got ur Patek 5035Y from your friend that chucks the watches in the glove compartment of his
BMW?

Oh that. I had a seller's remorse moment and wanted to buy back a 5035. But it didn't materialize as I was short of money at that time. I lost contact with him over the years.

[Friedrice]

Thats one honest story. I like. It makes 'poor' people like me feel proud not owning one despite the fact that i cant afford one.

Owning a nice watch is nice for a few weeks. But after awhile, buyer's remorse will set in and you will be asking yourself why the heck did you spend X amount on a watch when that money can be place into a ASB account, which earns a high rate of return even though the amount is capped. or the money can be placed in a didik account for your kids.

[sidestreaker]

As a dive watch fan who grew up reading National Geographic, I always wanted a Sub, Sea-Dweller, or GMT when I was a kid. When I started to REALLY get into watches, I learnt that they are more of a status symbol than a typical watch. The prices were crazy, but I still wanted one. On my honeymoon I was lucky enough to land THE sports Rolex, a 16600.

That was 4 1/2 years ago and I have enjoyed it, it's been a great watch, it's Rolex at the top of their game. Which, unfortunately, was MANY years ago. In a way it is the ultimate dive watch, having been developed during an era when watches were instruments, not luxury jewellery, and was worn on the deepest ever dive.

But now I'm bored of it. It's just a steel watch, I've owned much better watches for a fraction of the price, I'm thankfully now immune to the Rolex marketing juggernaut. It was fun, but I'm really looking forward to having the cash!

All of Rolex's innovations in the last two decades have been in marketing or business management. They benefit Rolex greatly but the consumer nil, apart from telling people who notice that you can afford to strap a used car to your wrist. That's not me - I'm just an ordinary guy who likes watches!

So long, Rolex!

Well, it is better to realize it sooner than later, I guess. The bright side is that you're crystal clear and able to see through the shroud and go for what you really like or need.

I wish I can say the same thing. On the one hand, I'm leaning towards fair value and quality watches like Seiko, but on the other hand, I'm still enticed with some marketing materials of a watchmaker like heritage, and owning a piece of a company that makes unnecessary complications.

I admit that I do have that shallow sense of pride of owning a well recognized brand to be seen. I do not know how long that sense of novelty will last, but it is a path which I'm carefully threading to avoid regrets later.

[hanz079]

I tot u got ur Patek 5035Y from your friend that chucks the watches in the glove compartment of his
BMW?

Oh that. I had a seller's remorse moment and wanted to buy back a 5035. But it didn't materialize as I was short of money at that time. I lost contact with him over the years.

After selling a PP 5035Y because the  "servicing cost scared you silly"... You seriously considered buying back the same watch from a friend that just chucks em in his glove compartment? I am no pro but that does scream "service me please!!"
Not to mention about your plan of putting the purchase of the pp on hold becuase your wife just got herself Mercedes...
I do wonder your PP journey to be honest.

[Friedrice]

I tot u got ur Patek 5035Y from your friend that chucks the watches in the glove compartment of his
BMW?

Oh that. I had a seller's remorse moment and wanted to buy back a 5035. But it didn't materialize as I was short of money at that time. I lost contact with him over the years.

After selling a PP 5035Y because the  "servicing cost scared you silly"... You seriously considered buying back the same watch from a friend that just chucks em in his glove compartment? I am no pro but that does scream "service me please!!"
Not to mention about your plan of putting the purchase of the pp on hold becuase your wife just got herself Mercedes...
I do wonder your PP journey to be honest.

Hey it's cool. If you think I am not telling the truth, it's all good. Everyone have the right to their own opinions. Especially something as subjective as this.

I have no proof that i owned a 5035 in the past as the watch was bought and sold before I started taking pictures of my collection. You just have to take my word for it. But if a forum moderator, thinks that I am lying, so be it. I am not going to argue with a forum moderator and getting myself into trouble.

[nikfs1881]

Chill bro! He was just pulling your leg.... I have seen you get agitated quite frequently over these past few days..... Let's talk bout watch and enjoy the sheer pleasure of owning good watches..... chill out!


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[nikfs1881]

And, one should not feel offended especially coming from someone that always say 'picture or it didnt happen'....dont get me wrong i think the statement is perfectly fine as part of camaraderie between WIS


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[Friedrice]

Chill bro! He was just pulling your leg.... I have seen you get agitated quite frequently over these past few days..... Let's talk bout watch and enjoy the sheer pleasure of owning good watches..... chill out!


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My apologies if I seem agitated these past few days. I didn't even realise it myself.

Many thanks for pointing it out to me. 

And, one should not feel offended especially coming from someone that always say 'picture or it didnt happen'....dont get me wrong i think the statement is perfectly fine as part of camaraderie between WIS


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Yup. Agree. Thanks for the advice. 

[nikfs1881]

Thanks for being such a gentlemen bro! And, my sincerest apology for pointing that out.... Thanks!


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[G.MAC]

For me, the realisation that a Rolex is just a watch shows that we are starting to look at the practical side of things. I do agree that a watch is just a timekeeping tool and any brand can tell the time as well as the expensive brands. The only way I tell myself why I should keep my collection and not sell it off is the fact a watch is one of the accessories a man can have. That is why i keep my current collection but I keep telling myself that I should not upgrade any further and just be glad with what I have. Just my two cents on the matter.

[CKL1213]

I need a watch but I want a Rolex

[Friedrice]

I need a watch but I want a Rolex

Go for it. It's a good brand. 

[axaxax]

Just a personal opinion owning one after going thru afew watches. Dropping a sum of money sometimes made me feel guilty as one of you correctly pointed out that its a piece that you dont need but more of a want. Money spend could have helped a poor kid thru college for example!

Never the less, when buying for a watch, i would always seek out certain characteristic of the watch/brand which i am aligned with. And in Rolex, I identify Rolex not for its brand, nor the watch itself but the company's relentless pursuit to improve their products. A populor term "Kaizen" or in english means "continues improvement" and not trying to seek that major innovation nor the silver bullet (neither should one forego any opportunity if one arises), i love the fact that the company have/is improved/improving in each iteration. These track record is not built over night but over many many years resisting critics (not completely true as seen in their decision to discontinue sea dweller replaced by deep sea and relaunching it after several years) whom calls em dull, lack of creativity, dime in a dozen etc etc.

No doubt some people flock to a certain brand to show prestige or wealth, strapping on a Rolex every morning reminds me to constantly seek the "Kaizen" in life.

[jason_recliner]

Is interesting how our perception differs. I see minimal evidence of kaizen and maximal evidence of marketing BS.

For kaizen I look, unsurprisingly, to the Japanese. The most accurate watches in the world... Watches that resist shock... Dive watches that measure and record depth... Watches with 48 timezones and 5 alarms... Watches that monitor heart rate... Watches with GPS... To me that is real improvement, real innovation.  The result of application and hard work. Constant improvement. Kai zen.

In the time that Citizen did all that, Rolex maybe introduced sapphire and a new hairspring compound.  I would like to see the increase in size of Rolex's marketing department and budget over this same period.

Rolex have been extremely innovative in their business processes, and this is true kai zen but, as I alluded to above, this benefits Rolex rather than me.

Just a personal opinion owning one after going thru afew watches. Dropping a sum of money sometimes made me feel guilty as one of you correctly pointed out that its a piece that you dont need but more of a want. Money spend could have helped a poor kid thru college for example!

Never the less, when buying for a watch, i would always seek out certain characteristic of the watch/brand which i am aligned with. And in Rolex, I identify Rolex not for its brand, nor the watch itself but the company's relentless pursuit to improve their products. A populor term "Kaizen" or in english means "continues improvement" and not trying to seek that major innovation nor the silver bullet (neither should one forego any opportunity if one arises), i love the fact that the company have/is improved/improving in each iteration. These track record is not built over night but over many many years resisting critics (not completely true as seen in their decision to discontinue sea dweller replaced by deep sea and relaunching it after several years) whom calls em dull, lack of creativity, dime in a dozen etc etc.

No doubt some people flock to a certain brand to show prestige or wealth, strapping on a Rolex every morning reminds me to constantly seek the "Kaizen" in life.

[axaxax]

My thought were that there are differences in focusing on improving a specific product versus hitting everywhere. And of course the cost of paying premium over a specific function when there exist an obvious cheaper or more efficient solution to it. What i was merely pointing out was a personal belief which transcends these logics. It can be fair for anyone whom might refer me as a brainless consumer taken over by Rolex's propaganda machineries. Then again, if we were to remove emotion and passion in pursuit of Horology, all of us would have bought Quartz watches vis-a-vis mechanical watches.

Personally, when Seiko Astron was launched, i thought to myself that this can potentially be a be-all, end-all watch. But! a Seiko Astron would not be able to spark that enjoyment i feel when strapping up in the morning neither the pleasure of winding my watch every morning.

What you have pointed out are indeed opinion that holds up and appeals to utilitarian and I understand where you are coming from. Sometimes one gets tired in such pursuit and decide to get out as one only see madness around (in this case, Rolex). Before things get too heated up, to each his own. I hope to read more stories of your horological pilgrimage.

[nikfs1881]

Well said Alex.....that's how i understand kaizen concept too... Continuous improvement of existing process or product instead of hitting everywhere (which will affect the resale value)....And, you are absolutely right when you say that if we really want innovation, all of us would have bought quartz or smart watches vis-a-vis mech watches.....


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[jason_recliner]

Kai zen is continuous improvement, but not of the same process or product. From Wikipedia:

"While kaizen (at Toyota) usually delivers small improvements, the culture of continual aligned small improvements and standardization yields large results in terms of overall improvement in productivity. "

Hence, by applying kai zen one would expect relatively rapid increase in productivity, quality, and evolution of product design.

[nikfs1881]

I saw that coming....thanks for the mba 101 lesson...... In watch context, that sounds like an iWatch or a superquartz to me.....


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